this is siwon's bitchface for you AFP

[meitachi]

So I guess I don't normally comment on these things, but this time, I really have to just put it out there because it bothers me enough that I want to make a statement:

Amanda Fucking Palmer, I am not a fan.

In the interest of full disclosure, the first I ever heard of her was that she was dating (and is now engaged) to writer Neil Gaiman (of whose works I am a fan, though I am reserving judgment about whether or not I am fan of him as a person). Then unfunnybusiness, fandom_wank, and sf_drama has sort of fed me the rest of it. Which colors me slightly biased since those are all reports of her fail, but there you go. Maybe she should work harder at not failing so hard.

You know what, AFP?
- the see-through dress and stripping at an awards show was not really a problem (it was upon request of the media, after the awards ceremony, and the flash didn't help)
- Evelyn Evelyn, however, rubbed me all the wrong ways; it is offensive in so many ways and you playing it off as edgy and artistic does not make it okay
- and now? You decide you don't support Lady Gaga's product placements in her Telephone MV so you tweet, and I quote, "ironic product placement is only ok if you take no money & beyond that give all the income to something ironic. like the Klan."

As in, the KKK.

Really? NO.



You are doing it wrong.

Ugh.

I'll let the links do the talking because they make the point far better than I ever could. Read and learn. The internet is "real life", folks. What you say here does reflect who you are as a person. It does impact how people see you. And in AFP's case, it does affect the people who will or will not buy your music or support your career or what have you. I've never been one of those people but, hey, now I know I never will be.

ETA: Write-up on sf_drama

Comments

[hoyah.livejournal.com]

... @_@ i just followed all those links and omfg it's like she's a real life troll

[meiface.livejournal.com]

I know! I'm like: how can you possibly be real? But she is, like, sincere in her ~art~ or something, and the rest of us are just not edgy enough to get it? Or something. Argh.

[peachpastiche.livejournal.com]

I seriously didn't think my opinion of her could sink any lower after the Evelyn Evelyn thing. Good to know!

the best part is that I bet she thinks she's so much more ~sincere~ and ~artistic~ than Lady Gaga. because being ~edgy~ is totally the antithesis of societal construction amirite

[peachpastiche.livejournal.com]

ALSO THIS IS NOT WHAT IRONY MEANS

THIS IS A VERY BAD DEFINITION OF IRONY

[meiface.livejournal.com]

I saw a comment somewhere on this that made me lol: Maybe she learned her definition of irony from Alannis Morissette.

[meiface.livejournal.com]

Yeah, she keeps surprising me. :|

The weird thing is that she's openly supported Lady Gaga before so I think she's just trying for the "hipster racism" bit with that tweet. Oh shocking and ironic, but oh of course it's all ~satirical~ and an artistic statement, you shouldn't be offended or mistake my intent! Or whatthefuck ever.

[peachpastiche.livejournal.com]

I am just trying to remind myself that love is blind and Neil doesn't have the absolute best track record re: appropriation and such already and loving someone means forgiving them for the stupid shit they do but good god

Most of us have dated a douchebag at some point but please don't bring it home and marry it, Neil

[meiface.livejournal.com]

There have been a lot of comments questioning what Neil sees in her. It makes me slightly uncomfortable when it seems like people are blaming him for her being awful, because she is perfectly capable of being awful on her own, thanks - but yeah, I see their discomfort too, because I sort of wonder the same thing. Are you really okay with the kind of assholish behavior she's displayed so flagrantly with no attempts to apologize or anything, Neil?

Thus I reserve judgment on him as a person and say only that I've enjoyed his books. :[

[peachpastiche.livejournal.com]

I think I found the answer here:

http://karnythia.livejournal.com/1500568.html?thread=30591640&format=light#t30591640

His ex-wife is or was a Scientologist. OTOH, his parents were Scientologists, and his sisters work for the CoS and a Scientologist clinic, so he is probably less allergic to that than, say, I am.

So, um. My guess is that he mastered the art of cognitive dissonance long before he started dating Amanda Palmer.

The part in the obituary linked above, where Gaiman's parents went to Chernobyl in the aftermath of the nuclear disaster to do the L. Ron Hubbard healing on the children...

I think that if you grow up in a family like that, you learn to separate the way-out things people you love say from your feelings about them. Because if my Dad went to Xenu-bother children with radiation sickness, I would either have to hate him forever or develop a strong tolerance for cognitive dissonance.

[meiface.livejournal.com]

Huh, this makes sense. I think everyone does it to some extent, but apparently Gaiman's really had to invest in it.

[vanillacat.livejournal.com]

I'm torn. My friend is a huge fan of her music and I think she just kind of ignores all the trolling, and I admit... sometimes, she makes good music.





My theory is that she like, doesn't realize she's being offensive at first, and then when she's confronted about it, she's too stubborn to back down.

[meiface.livejournal.com]

Making good music does not preclude you from being an asshole though. There are a lot of people in the above-linked posts who are or were fans of her music but who are frankly disgusted by her behavior. They're not mutually exclusive things. :/

Oh yeah, she definitely refuses to back down. When people bring up serious concerns with her - i.e., they write polite emails or letters or posts detailing why her actions were offensive - she blows them off on a tweet, dismissing them as having too much time or not understanding her artistry or whatever. Maybe it's the cool edgy hipster thing to do to never apologize?

[forochel.livejournal.com]

...



she needs to take a course in English. ):

[forochel.livejournal.com]

also! I think she is a shock artist! but then...she doesn't like it very much when people recover from the shock and point out all the things wrong with what she is doing to shock people. because some things are just not okay. ):

[forochel.livejournal.com]

(haha it's ok, this is an open discussion anyway!) ah, I called her a shock artist because that is what I've read other people call her - but I would basically agree with your assessment of her behaviour. I can't comment on her talent or anything, seeing as I've never listened to her music, but her antics don't particularly endear me to her anyway.

[meiface.livejournal.com]

I agree with you and also, ow, ow, ow. /flinches and I don't even have those parts

[forochel.livejournal.com]

I KNOW ;A; SOMETIMES ... IDK WHY SHOCK ARTISTS EXIST. ISN'T ART SUPPOSED TO, IDK, PROVOKE DEEP FEELINGS AND EMOTION OR A SENSE OF GREAT BEAUTY? HOW DOES DOING SOMETHING REALLY GROSS LIKE THAT DO ANYTHING BUT PROVOKE REVULSION AND GENERAL EW-NESS.

[meiface.livejournal.com]

Well, granted, kneejerk revulsion and "OW OW OW" is a very strong emotion. So they succeeded in provoking visceral reaction from the audience, I'd say.

[forochel.livejournal.com]

...I would say, "but at extreme cost to themselves" except I know their reply would probably be "I suffer for my art!!!!"


so I will just say: man, these are some really retarded, pretentious fucks.

[meiface.livejournal.com]

Me, personally, being selfish and not particularly fond of pain - I wouldn't suffer that much for my art. ;__;

[meiface.livejournal.com]

or, you know, common sense and basic courtesy. :(

[forochel.livejournal.com]

and basic human decency! I mean. HONESTLY.

[meiface.livejournal.com]

IT'S HARD FOR SOME PEOPLE, OKAY? Apparently being an ~artist~ gives you a free pass for outrageous, shocking, and offensive behavior!



...I mean, I support art but at some point you cross a line and it's no longer art, you're just an asshole.

[forochel.livejournal.com]

): really. )))))))))))))))): people who think like that make me make that face because - idk, I am so Chinese when it comes to these things but my first thought is 他们真的没教养！！！！ BUT REALLY. how can they think like that! freedom of expression is all very good but you have to take responsibility for what you say and do! and that means you have to think about the consequences of what you say and do and consider other people!!!! roar roar roar.

art to make a point and provoke thought, to make concrete social commentary is okay! it's good! but I really just. sigh. oh, mei, this is tying me all up in knots and I don't know how to express my feelings. D:

[meiface.livejournal.com]

I'm a huge proponent of free speech and expression (especially since I've taken all these courses on censorship and the constitutional rights in the US regarding free speech and expression), but those rights aren't absolute. They extend pretty far (we even protect the right to hate speech, as long as it's speech and not...hate crimes...) but just because it might be allowed legally doesn't mean that you don't suffer the real-world consequences of hurting people and society and getting smacked down by people who disagree with you. That's their right, to call you a douchebag.

I don't know, I mean. I guess I'm saying, yeah, AFP has the legal right to say these things, but she's also an offensive fuckhead who is insensitive and stupid and whose actions are not (morally) justified by her ~art~.